[00:00:00] Kam: The other day I woke up before everyone else in my house. I took the rare opportunity to do some prayer time, get a little exercise, start a load of laundry and create a list for the day. Since I’m old school, I used a pen and wrote the list on a piece of paper. This way I could go through the day and cross off as I accomplished each and every task I had listed. The list was long and detailed and filled the paper. You know the one…to make it through the list I would need at least 37 hours, a clone, no distractions and an unsafe amount of energy drinks. At the end of the day I fell into bed having crossed off two items from my list. I felt partially defeated but somewhat accomplished since I HAD gotten SOME things done that were not on the list.
Welcome to episode 8 of the Maker’s Space and I am so excited to introduce you to my guest Elise Enriquez. She is a productivity coach who convinced me that this is not a failed attempt to organize my time. It’s actually pretty common but not the most productive and definitely not helpful. I have always planned my day this way in hopes of maintaining the super-human intentions that only lead to disappointment. For my own mental health, I don’t create these lists much anymore or when I do, it’s to “brain dump” which was exactly how Elise referred to it.
This was such an eye opener type of conversation with some great how to’s. I hope you enjoy it and get as much out of it as I did!
Well first of all, I want to thank Elise and welcome her onto the podcast. And Elise, if you could just tell my listeners who you are and kind of where you are located.
[00:00:14] Elise: Sure, sure. I am a productivity coach. My name is Elise Enrique, and I love helping business owners to make the shift that they need to make in their productivity away from trying to get it all done to moving forward, what matters most. And so it’s a very different approach at the like, Molecular level yeah. To do that kind of thing.
[00:00:35] Elise: And I am based in the Seattle area, so I am look, usually, I love having my windows open and my blinds open to like let any daylight in and it is a gray, rainy, like how everybody thinks of Seattle kind of day today. Yes it
[00:00:50] Kam: is. I have never been, but um, here I’m in Iowa and like we have had such a dry summer, I send it here. Send me the gray, send me the rain. Whatever you wanna send. I
[00:01:04] Elise: would, I would love to just scoop it on over. I would love to. We actually, we had a fairly dry summer, then we’ll get like an early fall kind of rainy season and then it drs out again. It’s just, we have, you kind of just never know with Seattle. Yeah. You’re. The weather forecast is always like, ah, 50% chance of rain. You’re like, all right, okay.
[00:01:26] Kam: that 50% chance. That’s always
[00:01:29] Elise: funny.
[00:01:29] Elise: Just kind of, you just kind of go with it. Like you get excited when you see like a full sunshine on the forecast. You’re like, Is it possible ? Is it possible?
[00:01:37] Kam: Actually 65% on that one ?
[00:01:41] Elise: Yes, I know, right?
[00:01:43] Kam: Well, and so what you were talking about with your business, that was one of the reasons that I wanted to have you on and I was really excited about today and talking to you because I really wanna try to help the moms who, you know, are at home with, you know, trying to raise their families and still kind of have their craft business and get that going. You know, the girls that are kind of torn. They want, they’ve got that entrepreneur spirit, but they, you know, they love their family and they wanna be good with that.
[00:02:16] Kam: And so trying to bring somebody on who can kind of speak to that and yeah, kind of help us walk through it, I guess. Yeah, and I think it’s, it’s hard, you know, being a woman anyway, you know, so then to, to have those added hats I think is another challenge. But you know, if we kind of share our insights and experiences, I think that helps.
[00:02:42] Kam: So, yeah.
[00:02:43] Elise: Yeah, absolutely. And those, and I, it’s, that’s who I love to work with is, is women who are running their own businesses and any degree, or any size, or they’re even just service providers. But when you’re running your own business and you’re running a household, right, and you have kids in that household, like it’s, it just, it starts to layer on.
[00:03:02] Elise: So much onto our brains that it’s hard to keep track of all of it. And my goal with people is to really say, okay, how do we get everything out of your head and in front of you so you can make conscious choices about what you’re doing and how you’re spending your time. Yeah. Instead of kind of being in reactive mode.
[00:03:19] Elise: Because when we are just trying to get a business off the ground or keep a business going, we know that we need to be responsive to people and like hop on opportunities and do everything we can. Right. There’s like a little. Of a hustle that can happen at the beginning, and if we’re not careful, we can stay in that mode and turn into being very reactive instead of responsive and being very reactive instead of intentional.
[00:03:43] Elise: And so for me, what productivity is about is really about helping you to be more intentional about how you’re spending your time and your energy. .
[00:03:51] Kam: Well, let’s jump into that. Like what would you kind of speak to that mom that you know, she’s got little people and I honestly wouldn’t even speak to just the little people moms, I’ve got teenagers, you know, and they’re constantly, um, You know, there’s sports, there’s activities, there’s a bunch of things. So what would you kind of like help her lunch? You know, trying to get time organized, I guess. Yeah. What, what would kind of be your first steps in that? What
[00:04:25] Elise: I generally have people do is to start out with, at the, at the very beginning, is to, to start to narrow the number of places that you’re keeping things.
[00:04:34] Elise: And what I mean is like keeping the ideas, keeping the requests, keeping the needs, keeping like whatever it is that might. You might need to do to minimize the number of places that you store those things so that you don’t have things scattered everywhere, because then it’s hard to prioritize when everything is just everywhere.
[00:04:52] Elise: And so I call those gathering spots, right? And so it’s really important to have those gathering spots be intentional. And what that means is there’s very few of them you keep them as close to you as possible. So your phone is a great way, you know, like having an app that you can use to capture any little thing that pops into your head, right?
[00:05:09] Elise: Yeah. Um, and then processing it or emptying those gathering spots frequently. So, What that allows you to do is go about your day. And if an interruption like so I think I say interruption with quotes because I think we often think of interruptions as almost like as bad things, but interruptions are just things that were unplanned.
[00:05:27] Elise: And those can be good things, right? They can be ideas and inspiration, you know, and you can be talking to your kid and they say something that sparks an idea for the next thing you wanna. You don’t wanna let that inspiration go, so having a place to gather that up and like snatch it up and like put it somewhere so that you don’t forget it, and you can go back to being with your kid.
[00:05:45] Elise: You can go back to, you know, your workout, you can go back to prepping dinner, whatever it might be. You have a limited number of places. To just kind of pull everything together and then empty them on a regular basis. So that’s kind of the first thing where people get relief right away is to just like get rid of all the post-its, or at least make sure the post-its get processed on a regular basis.
[00:06:07] Elise: Right? Like get everything into a limited amount of spaces.
[00:06:11] Kam: Now, I know you said Post-Its and I know you can get, um, on Google, like if you have, you know, a Google email or a Gmail or that kind of thing, and you can get the, the part of that if you get the suite. I don’t even know what did they rename that to now the office, I
[00:06:28] Elise: know, I feel like they keep renaming it and I’m like, I don’t know what stuff is anymore, but
[00:06:32] Kam: they have a spot where you can actually create, uh, computerized post-it notes.
[00:06:39] Kam: Mm-hmm. So is, is that a platform you would suggest, or do you kind of have a favorite that you like to suggest for
[00:06:45] Elise: that? I, I admit I have a favorite. Do you And what, what I’ll have to make, what I’ll make sure I do is I’ll make sure that you guys get a link for the notes, because I get you an extended free trial of this thing.
[00:06:57] Elise: Um, so it’s called GQs and so it actually works with the Google platform. So if you have Gmail, you’re using Google Calendar already. There’s a, it’s a independent product, uh, called GQs, uh, and I think they’re based out of Colorado or something. But anyway, okay. It is it. What I like about it is it’s simple.
[00:07:18] Elise: It’s a to-do list system, basically that is simple enough that you can put stuff in there, but you can make it kind of as complex as you need to without being able to make it too complex. Because a lot of task management systems out there, a lot of people use CRMs and things like that. They just do too much and people think of the technology.
[00:07:40] Elise: Is going to be the solution. And it’s, that’s not the case. The the, what the reality is, is that yes, the technology can hold things, but you have to decide what you want it to hold. You have to decide what your standards are in your life and in your business, and then you pick the technology that supports what those standards are.
[00:07:59] Elise: And so people do it the other way around. They pick the technology thinking, okay, now I have this app, or, Unfortunately, some businesses, there’s like a CRM and it’s like thousands of dollars and it’s like, and then they don’t use it because they haven’t thought about, how do I really wanna do business?
[00:08:15] Elise: How do I really wanna do my life? What matters most to me? And what’s the simplest way? I can have a system that supports me. I am a fan of starting cheap, you know, so free when possible, but like I love it. And simple. Yep. So that way you can establish your kind of how you’re gonna operate in your life and in your work.
[00:08:38] Elise: And then if you discover from there that either you need more complexity that requires different technology, great. Or. like, like the jackpot is that you have so much business that for some reason, you know, your app or tool can’t support that and you need different technology, great, but at least you already kind of have how you wanna operate in place and.
[00:09:00] Elise: You already have a way of doing it, you just probably don’t know it yet. right? Like you have a
[00:09:05] Kam: lot of people, it’s in their head. So to get into a process,
[00:09:10] Elise: it’s, it’s hard to do because you created your own business, right? So you’ve created this thing yourself, and it wasn’t always something that you thought about from a process perspective.
[00:09:20] Elise: Unless you’re a dork like me who likes to think about that kinda stuff. But, You just did it organically based on what you believe in and how you wanna treat people and how you wanna do things. And it shifts and changes. And so to then think of like, how do I formalize this even when it’s just me, that it’s actually important to do, it’s super important to do.
[00:09:40] Elise: And then have the system that supports you, not a system that. Makes you do things, not a system that you feel bad about because you’re not checking everything off. Something that he just helps you remind you of what you said was important so that you can make choices every day about how you spend your time.
[00:09:57] Kam: Well, and it gets to be too, if you start, if everything is relying on you to do it. Uh, I recently had a client, uh, that. We say in our little circles that I’m in, we say the hit by a bus, uh, issue. You know, if you are the only one that your bus is or that your business is relying on and something happens to you.
[00:10:22] Kam: And that actually just happened to me. It didn’t happen to me but my client and all of a sudden I didn’t have that money coming in. And so it really made me evaluate what my processes are. From every perspective, like what is my backup plan if my client gets hit by a bus? I mean, and I know that sounds a little dramatic, but you know, if something happens and I have had.
[00:10:47] Kam: Clients. Cause I, I have worked a lot with website designers, so they work with other businesses too. So if something happens to their client and we’ve, we’ve seen where they have passed away and the wife comes in and takes over the business and something like that. Yeah. So you, you really do need to have those processes in place as you’re going and as you’re building any business really.
[00:11:11] Kam: Because if you break a leg and you know, you. You know, function the way that you want, or, or something happens, you know, your parent gets sick or something like that and you’re now out and you can’t create what you’re supposed to to fulfill orders. You know, having those systems in place. So having, you know, A platform and I like that, you know, you’re going simple and, um, always simple I know.
[00:11:41] Kam: And some of the CRMs can, can be so beefy and Yeah. You know, so much stuff that at least my listeners, I don’t think they would use. Something, you know, I mean, some of these CRMs are amazing. They’re colorful and you can put so much in ’em, but they’re very overwhelming and Yep. You know, until you’re gonna build a team and get to that extent, you know, and, and to me, that’s a whole other podcast.
[00:12:10] Kam: So
[00:12:11] Elise: Yeah, that’s, that’s about volume, right? That’s like, you know, you, and you can’t scale. Something that doesn’t exist, right? Mm-hmm. . So you can’t scale up your processes or your flow or your standards, right? If they don’t exist, they, they’re existing in here. They’re existing in your actions that you’re doing every day.
[00:12:30] Elise: But that doesn’t mean you have to document your process in order to support the standards that you’re you have in place. And when I say standards, just like. How quickly do you turn around in order? What is the level, you know, how do you package things in a way that’s consistent so that people, you know from the very beginning get the experience that you want them to get?
[00:12:49] Elise: How do you, you know, post something so that people can see, you know, like what’s the format for posting that again, that somebody can look at and go, oh yeah, I know who this is and I know what I can expect and I know what this is gonna. , you can do that first by just having your own support through a checklist, right?
[00:13:06] Elise: A simple checklist that you can say, okay, these are the things I do so that I remember to do ’em every time. Instead of having to keep reinventing the wheel. And then when you get help, that checklist is gonna get improved because it, it’s so funny cuz I’m experiencing this now. I have a VA that helps me support my it’s called my just community just stands for get your shit together, stuff together, however you wanna say it, but get your stuff together.
[00:13:29] Elise: I thought that was tough. Ok. Get your stuff together. Um, it’s like, get your systems together basically. Right, right, right. And so, So there’s a lot of work behind the scenes to support that community that I was doing right.
[00:13:43] Elise: I knew how to do it all, and I had a lot of templates for all the emails and all the different things. And so there was a, uh, like a first draft really of all these processes there, and then you bring somebody in to help you and they get way. Because you have to explain yourself to people, so it’s okay for it to be just enough bullet points to get you through, right?
[00:14:06] Elise: To remind you of the things that you want, how for how you want things to appear so you’re not recreating the wheel every time you’re doing a different part of your process. But
[00:14:16] Kam: I think even if people don’t like to use a checklist, I think even just to create one, even if it is just you, you get into that mindset of just kind of repeating and it goes faster. Even if it’s, you’ve got the, the list, you know, in a document and now you’re just envisioning it as you’re going. I think that still kind of helps. Wouldn’t you agree? Like
[00:14:42] Elise: Oh, absolutely. Just to kinda have that. It’s it, and what it does eventually is if you do get to the point where you want to hire help and you’re ready to hire help, when you start kind of documenting process, even at a very high level, you start to realize, oh, somebody else could do this.
[00:15:01] Elise: Yeah, it’s very exciting. It’s very exciting for me to be able to know that when it comes to this work with my community, where I have somebody else doing the admin stuff, it means I get to show up with my best energy live Yeah. For my people. And I get to show up with my best energy when I’m creating things that are, that are special for them.
[00:15:19] Elise: Right. So I, they get the best of me because I, along the way was documenting my little processes. That I was like, I don’t have to do this part . Somebody else could easily do, like somebody else can upload a video to a site for me. I don’t have to be the one to do that. Right. And it so, Documenting it helps you deliver the standard that you decided you wanted to deliver for your people that you decide, not that everybody else tells you you should do that you decide that you wanna deliver for your people.
[00:15:51] Elise: And this applies in life too. So this is like the standard for how you wanna do anything. It’s not, this doesn’t have to just be in your business, but it helps you continue to deliver consistently on. Experience for your people from beginning to end. And then, like I said, it helps you kind of open up your mind to like, oh, maybe I can get some help.
[00:16:11] Elise: Which is what I want, I want for all of us, right? Is like for all of us to be really in our highest and best use version of ourselves and let other people do the stuff that they’re better at than you. And that might be the uploading the video like somebody else loves that. Loves to be that person that’s doing those things.
[00:16:29] Elise: There is, there’s some other, I think social
[00:16:30] Kam: media. It’s like I, I have a friend who likes to do the social media, and to me that’s, it’s so redundant and mundane, but she enjoys doing it. She enjoys putting the posts together and, uh, ugh.
[00:16:46] Elise: Like, how cool for her, right? Yeah. And it’s like, no, thank you
[00:16:52] Kam: yeah, no, that is for sure.
[00:16:54] Kam: So, and while you were speaking, I was kind of thinking, do, do you suggest having kind of the processes and the plans and everything, So you have the mom’s side of life and then you have the business side of life. Do you put everything together into one or do you have two? Do separate intentions Now
[00:17:17] Elise: I what I know for us, like women, especially as business owners, All of it is coming at us all the time, and over time this will change and men will start doing it more too.
[00:17:30] Elise: Let’s hope for that, right? Like as we all continue to, to work on this, you know, hopefully they have some mind space taken up for the family too, and uh, that there’s just all stuff coming at us. I don’t actually even have kids. I have nieces that I’m a big part of their lives and I have tons of moms that I support.
[00:17:49] Elise: Yeah. But I don’t have kids. And the life pieces for come in all the time, right? For me. So to have kids as well, it’s like, it would be, it’s just a ton, right? Mm-hmm. So really having all of your action live in one place I think is really important because the reality is, Your schedule might, your work might be spread out throughout the day.
[00:18:13] Elise: You’re not leaving the house oftentimes in this, in, in your space, right? To go do a nine to five somewhere where you get to go. Just be that person for that amount of time, right? No. Right. You’re figuring out how to get kids off to school. Some of them are getting done at after a half day. Some of them need to get taken to sports, and so the work is getting fit in wherever you can.
[00:18:32] Elise: And so to have to look at two separate places. Going to just disperse like where the action is, and we wanna have you focused as much as possible on like, here’s everything that needs to get done. Because I am one person doing a lot of things. I’m not a bunch of different people. I am one person doing a lot of things.
[00:18:48] Elise: Here’s my one place to go to decide to. How things are gonna happen today, like to do a draft, right? Like cross your fingers. Hopefully the day goes like this, right? Yeah. Here’s that would be the next point. Here’s, yeah, here’s like the draft of what I said I wanted, you know, to do today. And it includes business and it includes personal because that is your reality.
[00:19:09] Elise: It’s really important for your systems to reflect your reality as much as possible. And in reality, you are one person doing all of these things. And I have to say that’s the beauty of being a business owner is you get to pick the tool that you use and you get to have all of it in there. It’s different when you work for somebody else, you’re having to use their tools and you maybe don’t wanna put your personal stuff and the work tool, you know, like that kind of thing.
[00:19:29] Elise: But when, right when it’s you and it’s your business, you get to pick and you get to choose and it gets to all live in one place. Like that’s an absolute gift that we get to have as business owners.
[00:19:39] Kam: So what about how much grace do we give ourselves on that list That just transfers to tomorrow’s list.
[00:19:49] Elise: so much we get to give ourselves so much grace but the the first way you do, yeah. The first way you do that though is you know, when you have everything one. That’s, that’s the beginning part, right? Like you have all of your action that might need to get done, lives in one tool, if at all possible. Um, and if it happens to live in two, there’s, it’s just that there’s never any duplication is what we’re shooting for, right?
[00:20:13] Elise: But so all lives in one place. So, um, so in, or in addition to having all of the action that might need to get done by you in one place, The other part in order to make that list for today, be realistic. You gotta be realistic about the time that you have.
[00:20:29] Elise: So the next thing that I usually have people do is make your calendar a reality check. And it’s, it’s really funny because I’m trained as a life coach. I help people accomplish really big and wonderful things, right? So I’m very aspirational with people. I help them be aspirational. And when it comes to their calendar, I.
[00:20:48] Elise: Aspiration goes out the window when it comes to your calendar. We want this realistic, we want this concrete, right? Like it’s, it’s being able to navigate back and forth in between the visionary creative space and acknowledging like just the actual realities of time. And so that means anything that requires your body or brain to be completely occupied, body and or brain to be completely occupied goes on your calendar.
[00:21:14] Elise: So if you are taking the kids to school, there’s really nothing else you can be doing at that time. You can’t be fulfilling
[00:21:21] Kam: an order. I’m very certain we could probably come up with, you know, we could do podcast listening and
[00:21:27] Elise: right? You can do that. You can listen to a podcast, but you can’t fulfill an order. You probably can’t do anything that you can check off of a to-do list. Right, right. Like, unless it was listened to this podcast, cuz I do sometimes have like, oh, list check out, you know, check out campus podcast. Right. To to know like, okay, where am I gonna be? Who am I talking to? So that might be on there, but like for the most part, there’s very little we can be doing when we’re driving.
[00:21:48] Elise: We might be in the pickup line. There might be some things you can do and we can talk about that in a minute, but, If you are at an appointment, if you are, if you need to eat food, which you do throughout the day, if you are going to be working out if you need to make dinner or make lunches, especially when during the pandemic and people were at home all the time, like suddenly you were making lunches for kids.
[00:22:10] Elise: Right. When they were eating lunch at school before. Right. Yeah. So it’s like it’s having all of that reality of your body and brain being occupied in your calendar for specific commitments, appointments, drive. Putting all of that there. Yeah, like as, honestly, tell me about your, that was like a
[00:22:30] Kam: big B friend.
[00:22:31] Kam: I, I’m just, I know. I would be terrible at it. I really need to practice doing this. And it comes with practice, doesn’t it? Like this isn’t something that you just suddenly wake up tomorrow and be like, I’m gonna do better.
[00:22:44] Elise: Like, and
[00:22:46] Kam: it’s one. Oh, go ahead. I know I would, I would just cram that calendar too full of stuff, and then I would beat myself up at the end of the day thinking I didn’t get everything.
[00:22:56] Elise: Yeah. And that you’re already doing that. We’re all already doing that. Yeah. Without being realistic about it. And so the shift that you make is to say, not here’s what I want to do. Right. That still stays on your task list.
[00:23:11] Kam: That’s a good point. That’s an excellent point.
[00:23:13] Elise: The calendar is just saying, here’s what I’ve already said I’ve committed to do with other. I’m driving somebody somewhere. I’ve committed to feeding myself lunch. I’ve committed to, you know, like whatever it is. It is a true time commitment outside of a task list because then you look at how much time you have on your calendar and you look at your task list that is that long, and you can say at the beginning of the day, oh, that’s funny.
[00:23:38] Elise: I’m not gonna get all this done. What’s most important? Right? What’s most important? And let me either let some of these things go, which that will take time. It takes people time to start letting things go. Usually at first you’re gonna start moving it forward, and that’s okay. You’re gonna move it forward until you realize, okay, maybe this isn’t important.
[00:23:59] Elise: I keep moving it forward. Or maybe I’m thinking about, maybe I don’t realize, but I have like a mindset block on this thing that I keep moving forward. Let me, you know, and this is where. My group coaching people will like show up and at certain calls that we have and be like, I need help with this mindset thing.
[00:24:15] Elise: I’m not getting this thing done. Help me out. Right? But it, it all gives you, it gives you data that you didn’t have before that, that you can actually look at and see and think about. Because before it was all here. All the thoughts, all the worry, or it was all on Post-Its everywhere and it was all in all these different apps and it was all like on some paper planner that you use once every couple of months, or it was like, it was in all these other places.
[00:24:43] Elise: And we’re just saying bring it all into fewer places so that you can make conscious decisions. about things instead of just letting things kind of happen and there’s, there’s room to let things happen. There’s room for spontaneity, there’s room for all of that. We’re not talking about stifling anything, we’re just saying, but you said there’s things you wanted to do.
[00:25:03] Elise: So when are you really gonna do it? Like, how can we look at the reality of your time and the reality of your ideas and decide what’s most important and be happy with making progress on those things and be just as happy with what we’re not getting. Because we know we’re not getting it done. We made a choice not to do it.
[00:25:22] Kam: Love that. Yeah. That’s, oh my gosh, so many great points that you’ve made. Now you made a comment about, um, and this kind of made me think, I’ve heard that a lot of people will suggest making their list for tomorrow at night. Mm-hmm. , do you, what do you recommend? Because what I’ve heard is, Immediately kind of gets it out of your brain and you’re actually sleeping better.
[00:25:50] Kam: Have you found that that is accurate or do you prefer people doing it in the morning? Like what have you found that works?
[00:25:59] Elise: What I found is that you don’t need to, it depends on where they’re coming from. So they might be coming from the perspective of like, oh, well I can’t sleep at night, so it’s better for me to like plan my day the next day.
[00:26:09] Elise: Okay. But oftentimes when people are saying that they don’t already have a place that’s holding everything, It’s a list that they’re making on paper. Right? And they’re trying to figure it out and it’s, and so it’s this thing that they have to think about so hard about that you don’t really have to think that hard about it when everything already lives.
[00:26:25] Elise: Anything that pops into your mind is already going into one place. Okay. That you’re managing on a regular basis anyway. So then, so let’s assume that that’s happening. Let’s assume that instead of you’re just like every day making a new paper list. Gives you shortterm relief. It does not give you long-term relief at all.
[00:26:42] Elise: So it gives you short-term relief to brain dump. Right? Does not give you long-term relief because you then you just keep brain dumping the same things over and over and over again. That’s true. Yeah. So now let’s assume instead. All the time when stuff is popping into their head, they’re putting it into whatever their tool of choice is.
[00:27:01] Elise: Like I said, I like GQs. It’s nice and simple and easy and cheap. Um, I, like I said, I like inexpensive. I like simple. Um, to get started, need to link that up. So, yes, we will definitely will, cuz it’s spelled weird and people will be like, what is, what is she talking about? Um, but let’s, let’s, let’s pretend now, like now that person is consistently, when things pop into their head, it just goes into their system.
[00:27:22] Elise: It goes into what I call your bonus brain. It goes into your system, it goes into your bonus brain, it goes into your bonus brain, it goes into your bonus brain. So that way. Once a week, you’re taking a look. Okay. What’s all the stuff that went in here that I haven’t really thought about? Okay, when do I wanna do those things?
[00:27:37] Elise: And so for the most part, you’ve already made decisions on a regular basis about what’s gonna get done and when or when you want things in front of you again, right? To think about. So now when it comes to planning your next day, you could do it the night before. If your energy is there for that, right? So it’s paying attention to your energy.
[00:27:55] Elise: So if your energy is there for that, you’re just saying, okay, am I being realistic about tomorrow? Right? Cause now you’re saying with what’s on my calendar, right? And what’s on my list. Am I being realistic about those things? No. Okay. These other things, I’m moving off. So now, tomorrow looks way more realistic.
[00:28:12] Elise: I’m gonna have a great night. , right? But you can also do it in the morning, right? So it’s, it’s playing around, but it’s trying something for at least a week to see how it feels. Whether you’re still doing paperless, that’s fine, but whatever it is, you gotta just try it and find out. The last thing I want people to do is think about it and research it, and it’s like, there can be studies that show 90% of people do better planning their list at night.
[00:28:36] Elise: You might be in the 10. . So if you’re holding yourself to this, 90% standard is not gonna help you. So the best thing you could do is run an experiment and find out, and I think
[00:28:47] Kam: the biggest thing that you have made, like the comment that you’ve made, is just being realistic. I think that’s, I mean, not only realistic in planning, but just kind of our expectations of ourselves and being realistic like that mean we have shortcomings.
[00:29:09] Kam: Like if we can’t be superwoman for a day, I have a low blood pressure issue and mm-hmm . So I have to make sure that I am maintaining a certain level of sodium or you know, whatever that’s going to be to build up that low blood pressure. Otherwise, it just tanks my energy level tanks and I’m not good for anything.
[00:29:32] Kam: But that doesn’t mean that I’ve had a bad unproductive day. I mean, that just means that I was, you know, unrealistic in my expectations of what I could physically achieve. And I think as women, we tend to think, you know, well, I’m going to be at my peak every day physically, and so I’ll be there
[00:29:54] Elise: mentally and, and every hour too.
[00:29:56] Elise: Yeah. Right. Like not just every day, but every hour equally, all day long. Yeah,
[00:30:03] Kam: no no
[00:30:05] Elise: true. I, the further the day goes for me, the like less ability I have to stay focused and concentrated. So I gotta do some of that work either in the morning or actually after dinner, right? Like those are my creativity times and it’s accepting that about myself.
[00:30:21] Elise: So it’s not just managing my time, but it’s managing my energy. If you have a low blood pressure episode that just somehow cause you’re gonna do your best and sometimes something’s not gonna work right in our bodies, whether it’s low blood pressure, low blood pressure, um, anxiety, depression, adhd, there are just some days, you know, PMs and, and menstrual cycles.
[00:30:45] Elise: There are just some days and weeks that our bodies are gonna just be cooperating really well and some that aren’t. And so the purpose of having your system is to allow you to make those choices as conditions change. And like I said, also as like interruptions arise and some of the interruptions might be critical.
[00:31:04] Elise: Emergencies that are scary and hard. Mm-hmm. , um, you know, like you said, you can have like a family member pass. You can have, uh, you know, a kid get hurt and you gotta get ’em over to urgent care and they can also be wonderful. Like all of a sudden you realize, you know, your best friends in town unexpectedly, and you guys can have lunch and you can look at.
[00:31:23] Elise: Your system, you can look at your bonus brain and make a conscious choice about, you know what, I’m okay with these things moving. And I can just go enjoy this time with this person because to me, productivity, what the shift, the productivity shift is all about is, is changing it from getting things done to moving forward, what matters most and sometimes moving your relationship with your best friend forward is what matters most.
[00:31:48] Elise: Sometimes. Yeah, resting and getting your blood sugar under control is what matters most. And so the system isn’t there to make you feel bad. The system is there to give. The ability to make choices about how you’re going to use your time as conditions change. Cuz they’re, oh my gosh. If it’s true, if conditions stayed how I needed them to be, to get everything done every day right. Like I would be unstoppable. Right. But that’s not, that’s not how it is. Yeah.
[00:32:17] Kam: That’s not how it works. It’s not real.
[00:32:20] Elise: It’s not realistic. And it sounds so funny, like if, if anybody, like anybody who’s known me for a long time knows that like when I am am dream mode with a client, I’m like, oh yeah, like we can do this, we can do that.
[00:32:34] Elise: We’d like, I, all of the ideas come and all the possibility to a possibilities are there, right? They’re. You’re still going to do that, and then you’re gonna say, okay, which of these things am I excited about? Oh, that’s, how am I gonna move that forward? How is that gonna fit in with this other stuff I said I was gonna do?
[00:32:52] Elise: Okay, maybe something comes up, right? So then it’s just like dream. Absolutely do that, right? Yeah. Come up with your next idea. Come up with the next way you’re gonna market the stuff, right? Like do all of that. And now you have to pull this down into your ground level of day to day life and say, How do I make that work and how do I have my system support me in making that happen instead of making me feel bad about what’s not getting done well?
[00:33:17] Kam: And that’s, uh, probably the next issue I would think to getting our stuff done. is trying to stay focused, you know, because as creatives we do have these ideas that, you know happen and you know, now we wanna start in this thing. How do we kind of maintain that, you know, the, the business that we’re creating, how do we stay on task with that?
[00:33:48] Kam: You know, when we have these other ideas, do we kind of create a plan to maintain these while testing these other waters? Like how would you suggest doing that?
[00:34:00] Elise: Yeah, I think that’s where it’s gonna come back to. Like the first thing is, you know, letting your ideas like have a moment to cure, right? , like letting them have a place to rest.
[00:34:11] Elise: And so, Your system can hold that too, right? You can have, so I actually have a section in my, so GQs is the app that I was talking about. I have a section in my GQs called Someday, maybe, right? That comes from David Allen’s work, um, getting things done. He has a someday maybe area, but it’s just a, it’s just a place for ideas and I get to go visit that place as much as I want to, and I get to decide if any of those ideas are ready for primetime, right?
[00:34:34] Elise: Like, are any of these ideas like ready to actually move into action? But I think sometimes it can be nice for when an idea hits you and an inspiration hits. Go ahead and get that in your system where, whatever that might be, maybe you have an ideas notebook or something, or, or it is an Evernote or OneNote, or it’s an actual physical notebook for ideas, but like you have a place to hold this thing and you can even like map out all of it and bring down all of it and like get all of it out there and then just let it sit for like a week.
[00:35:05] Elise: right? Like just, just a week and then go visit it again. Because what I’ve seen happen a lot is people get inspired by other people. So you have your own inspiration and inspiration that you just come up with with yourself, right? But you see like, oh, I could do that. Oh, I wanna do that. Oh, that’s working really well for them.
[00:35:25] Elise: Yeah, that’s a good idea. Right? But that doesn’t mean it’s a good idea for you. So that’s the thing is something might be an amazing idea, but is it a good idea for you? No.
[00:35:37] Kam: Such a great point. And I think, you know, so many, especially as crafters, I walk into Hobby Lobby just for inspiration on things. Yeah.
[00:35:48] Kam: And I have now come to be self-aware enough that scrapbooking not something that I should ever get into. It’s like I would have a whole room of stuff that I might use someday. Yep. But it’s not, so I love that just kind of sitting on it and letting it kind of fester and, and see if you actually do want to put that money and effort into it.
[00:36:17] Kam: So I like
[00:36:18] Elise: that a lot. Yeah. I mean, You can like have a Pinterest sport and pin all the ideas. You can do all this stuff in terms of just like, let me like really blow through this whole idea and not do anything yet. But so it’s so funny because people who know me well would be like, wait, Elise isn’t talking about taking action.
[00:36:37] Elise: Cuz usually I’m like, all right, what are you gonna do? But it’s like, but once you decide to do it, then yeah, all right, let’s try something. Right? But like, just give yourself a place to have those ideas where they could, to cure a little bit. You get to go back and visit them, because I know how it feels like you get a spark of inspiration and you just like, oh, I have to ride this wave.
[00:36:56] Elise: Yeah. Cause it’s here and it’s. Is that, is that true or have you just told yourself that?
[00:37:02] Kam: Or is it your personality? And so that is my segue to I know you are a certified Myers-Briggs coach, and I have talked a little bit on my podcast about, um, being a different personality and kind of discovering who you are.
[00:37:22] Kam: Um, I think now is a great time for introverts, you know, to kind of be online building a business. They don’t have to be, you know, out. Yes. You know, talking to
[00:37:33] Elise: people Yeah, sure. And making hands, networking and picking up cards.
[00:37:37] Kam: Yeah. Right. Mm-hmm. , that’s for us extroverts to do, which, you know, it’s totally fine. We can do either one. Knowing the type of personality you are, and I think that kind of helps with the realistic goals and planning and that kind of thing. So I do want you to speak to, you know, to the Meyers-Briggs part. What if you can kind of explain what the personalities are? I definitely want you to share what you are and then I’ll share what I am.
[00:38:07] Kam: we’re on the same page.
[00:38:10] Elise: Yeah. So when you hear. When you hear about Myers-Briggs, you’re usually hearing about these four letter types. And so these four letters are based on four dichotomies. And so there’s, they’re really just like, you know, four um, sets basically of traits that are, or four sets of preferences actually.
[00:38:27] Elise: And so it’s really about that you prefer something over something else, not that you are. Versus something else. And so the first set is extroversion and introversion. And that’s really just about energy and energy management and where you direct your attention and energy and where you get your attention or where you get your energy from.
[00:38:44] Elise: And so extroversion just means that you get it from the outside world and doing things and people and all that kind of stuff. You get energy there. You direct your attention there. Uh, it doesn’t mean you don’t need alone time. You can still be an extrovert that needs alone time to recover. I was just gonna say,
[00:38:59] Kam: I love that you said it’s. Because I know some people kind of get stuck in their personalities when they find it out too, and they’re like, Nope, I can’t do that. I’m an introvert, and that’s not it at all. So I love that you just said
[00:39:12] Elise: that. Yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s just really about where does my energy come from? Where do I direct my attention? And so, and it has nothing to do with how you behave socially. Like people would look at my wife and think that she was an extrovert and she is not. She definitely perverse introversion. Yeah, she definitely prefers introversion. So that’s the first set. So I, I prefer extrover. Okay, so I prefer extroversion, so, so I’m not an extrovert.
[00:39:39] Elise: I prefer extroversion. Right. Oh my gosh. Yeah. So that’s, that’s the link. That’s, that’s the, that’s the like language around it that helps soften it and not, like you said, lock into a personality. Right. The next one is all about the kind of information that you like and trust, and so there’s sensing and intuition, and sensing is all.
[00:39:58] Elise: The concrete, the like literally things that can be observed with your five senses, the data itself. Right. And intuition is more about a future orientation. Uh, connecting all the dots, really seeing where is all this going, what is the trend? What is the data telling us versus necessarily the hard concrete data itself.
[00:40:16] Elise: Whereas sensing is a little bit of a a like, what have we done before that works, let’s stick with it. Intuition is like, what could we do? Right. Okay. Um, and you’re capable of both. But you usually prefer one and therefore start with one and then can get to the other. Gotcha. So I prefer intuition, which is represented with an N.
[00:40:36] Elise: So for keeping score. For anybody? Keeping score at home, I’m an E and an N. So Cam, how about for you? Extroversion or intro? Which do
[00:40:43] Kam: you prefer? We’re the same so far we’re, we’re both? Yeah. Okay.
[00:40:47] Elise: We both prefer E and N, right? So extroversion and intuition. That’s the N. Yeah. Um, sensing is an S. Um, so then the next one is thinking and feeling, and that’s how we make decisions.
[00:41:00] Elise: So how do we go about making decisions? So this isn’t everything about our personality, this is about how we decide. Okay? And so somebody who prefers thinking is more logical, analytical, critical. Pros and cons cause and effect. They’re able to mentally remove themselves from the situation to study it, right, to study it and look at it more objectively.
[00:41:23] Elise: And then there is feeling, so that was thinking. Then there’s feeling and people who prefer feeling, they mentally put themselves into the situation they’re trying to identify with. Everybody consider the kind of the. Like values of the organization, the values of the people, the values of themselves, and make sure that everybody’s kind of getting what they need in some way, shape, or form.
[00:41:45] Elise: They’re more focused on, on harmony and everybody getting what they need. And somebody prefers thinking is typically more focused on the ob, you know, like being objective and, um, Making sure that everybody gets the same, like fairness means something different to each preference there. And so for me, I prefer feeling, which is an F.
[00:42:03] Elise: So how about for you? Yep, . Okay. Alright. So you’re like, you were guessing, right? For me it sounds like, Nope. So I prefer feeling and, and it doesn’t mean I’m not capable of objectivity, pros and cons cause and effect, right? I can totally lean into the thinking side of. I start, however, with feeling that’s where I start and that’s actually where I start across the board feeling is my most dominant function.
[00:42:28] Elise: And then finally, you get to judging and perceiving, and I never really love how they describe this at the high level in the Myers Briggs world, but, uh, it’s basically how you interact with the outside world. Okay. So, uh, when somebody who prefers judging, they, for, they’re very scheduled. They like to make short and long-term goals.
[00:42:46] Elise: They like to make decisions, come to conclusions and move on. They’re like, okay, okay, this has been decided, right? Like, the worst thing you can do with somebody who’s prefers judging is to reopen a decision to be able to say like, but wait a moment. You know, after something’s been decided, you’d be like, wait, how about this?
[00:43:01] Elise: You know? And then they’re just like, what? Then there’s those who prefer receiv. And those who prefer perceiving, they are all about keeping their options open. They want to explore the possibilities they see. In fact, they see the world that way as a bunch of opportunities, whereas people who prefer judging, they see the world as a bunch of decisions that need to get made, and that excites both of them.
[00:43:25] Elise: Each thing that they prefer excites them until it becomes too much , right? That’s somebody who prefers perceiving. They like to keep their things loose, open, and open to change, and they feel like they wanna get all the information they have before they make a decision. And new information can come in at any time, so they’re gonna postpone their decision making, right?
[00:43:44] Elise: And so these two preferences really. They can go wrong either way. When they’re overdone, you know, any of these, they can, they can, you know, it can get bad either way. So somebody who prefers judging could decide too quickly. Somebody who prefers perceiving could wait too long to decide. And so it’s usually somewhere, else in the middle that these folks can play.
[00:44:08] Elise: And so, um, probably obvious to most people by now that I prefer judging. So I love structure, I love creating systems. I love making decisions, coming to conclusions and moving on people who prefer perceiving can. Um, my wife can make me crazy, um, in some ways and are like my greatest gift cuz they keep.
[00:44:28] Elise: Spontaneous and like in different parts of my life I can really be spontaneous and in other parts I want more of the structure. That’s fair. And for me it’s like, oh, if, if the plan is, there is no plan, that’s a plan and I’m good. Okay, cool. So long as I know that right. , so that’s, so you prefer perceiving, is that right?
[00:44:47] Kam: I am perceiving however I. I can only sit in that for so long. And then we just, we need to be deciding something and we need to be moving on like we have other stuff to do, .
[00:45:00] Elise: So, and, and likewise for me, I can only sit in it for so long and I need to be considering other things and considering other possibilities and rethinking something.
[00:45:08] Elise: Right? So it’s, it’s true of, of all of the preferences is that we can stick in it too long, we can push it too far and forget that we are capable of, of more, but. The purpose of knowing anything like Myers Briggs, Enneagram is my favorite assessment, like any of those things is just to know where you’re at, right?
[00:45:28] Elise: So that you can flex out of it when you need to and to manage your energy. Myers Briggs to me, is a lot more about managing your energy to be able to say, I’m gonna need to be extroverted a lot today, and I prefer introversion. So I need to plan to like rest up ahead of time to get my energy up and I need to plan recovery time.
[00:45:46] Elise: Right? It’s just thinking about like, oh gosh, I’m gonna have to be like looking at data all day and crunching numbers and doing data entry, huh? I’m gonna need right some time to just like go be creative and loose and fun and right. And like I’m gonna need that recovery time to refill these tanks that are getting.
[00:46:05] Kam: And I think knowing who you are and, and how you function helps you to really, you know, develop your strengths, but also bring in somebody who can help you with your weaknesses and Absolutely. You know, and if you have, like I’m married to, um, he is an I. I S T J. So he’s on the complete opposite end of the second. Yeah. In fact, our reports said you should not be with each other . Cause you won’t work .
[00:46:41] Elise: Which you know isn’t true . I know.
[00:46:43] Kam: It’s, it’s not true. And we’ve worked for almost 30 years, so. Yeah. Um, but that’s awesome. Well, but when you’re aware. You know what their strengths and weaknesses are, like you said.
[00:46:55] Kam: Mm-hmm. , you know, your wife is, is an introvert, like, but she mm-hmm. sounds like she’s an extroverted introvert, you know, like she can, yes, she can do both. And, and that’s my husband. He does not like big crowds, so. Mm-hmm. if he goes with me to anywhere. I know that he is just gonna be fine off in the corner, and he lets me roam the room and I talk to everybody and I talk to everybody about everything, but the ride home will probably be quiet and mm-hmm.
[00:47:26] Kam: because I will have spent everything, you know? Yes. So I think, you know, when you’re creating a craft business, especially, and online especially mm-hmm and people don’t get that one on one with you. I think knowing your personality is so important, or at least being self aware of, of those. Mm-hmm. , you know, traits that you have, you know, when do you best function, you know, so you can plan and put that on your schedule and Yeah.
[00:47:56] Kam: Uh, you know, when do you. Are you gonna be creating crafts? I don’t like to get up early in the morning, but that’s my best functioning time. So that’s something that I have to be disciplined enough to, you know, put on a schedule. So I, I am
[00:48:12] Elise: curious, but then also have the, the freedom and flexibility beyond that, right?
[00:48:16] Elise: Because you don’t want, as somebody who prefers perceiving, being too scheduled is going to kill your creativity. Right, right. So it’s like it’s having that balance and you’re only gonna find out by running those experiments.
[00:48:27] Kam: Yeah, but I mean, you’ve made some amazing points like the. What’s, what’s really stuck with, stuck with me is the be realistic about my schedule.
[00:48:38] Kam: You know, but still have that, you know, side list of possibilities and things that you could work on, you know, that at least gives me hope that it’s never, you know, it’s not. Um, just stuck in a box and I can kind of branch out. So I think that speaks to a lot of creatives, you know, just in general. So I am curious and I, I have to watch your time.
[00:49:00] Kam: I don’t, I know I could probably take, I could talk to you for another hour, but, oh, I would
[00:49:04] Elise: do it too. So I’m just like, hell. Just keep going. I’m curious. I wish I could, I would love to say it like forever.
[00:49:11] Kam: I, I have to bring you on again, especially now that you have a va and since I have done that, I wanna know how your experiences with the va, so, yeah.
[00:49:19] Kam: Um, but no, I’m curious, how did you, like, what made you want to get certified to, to be a Myers-Briggs? Uh, Specialist.
[00:49:31] Elise: Yeah. So for me it’s, I I just love assessments. I just do. I love, I’ve like, I’ve probably taken, you know, most assessments out there and when I started and I, I had a general interest before I became a coach, but I’ve been coaching for 13 years now.
[00:49:47] Elise: And when I first was coaching, it wasn’t specific to kind of this world of productivity. Okay. Um, it was life coaching. Right. It was like very much more heavily personal. Okay. Side of things and. To be honest, an assessment is a shortcut. Like we could spend a lot of time trying to figure this out about a person, or I can give you a link.
[00:50:10] Elise: We can spend one session helping you decide what is your best type. Like the, like when you take an assessment, when assessments are done well, and that’s why I got certified, um, in my work is that it isn’t about, An online report told you, that is just a starting point. So if you are basing your personality type for anybody out there who’s based their personality type on some free thing that they did online, even if it was a paid thing they did online and you never got support from a professional about it, and it doesn’t feel like it fits you, then it’s the wrong type and that’s okay.
[00:50:44] Elise: Like yeah, it’s that like any of these assessments are how you answered questions one day of your. right. To me, the power of an assessment is that it just narrows it down to give you a starting point to see like, does this feel right? And if not, it’s probably, we’re probably close. And then once you can self-identify your type, then we get to keep going back to that to say, okay, what do you need?
[00:51:06] Elise: What do you need here? That’s good. We’re stuck. What do you need? Or your, uh, you know, where is a roadblock? Where can we anticipate a roadblock? Or, Hey, remember, you know, you tend to like do X, Y, and Z. So like, what do we wanna do about that? Right? And so, It’s a fast forward button on any kind of coaching work when you can have an assessment done in a professional, ethical way.
[00:51:32] Elise: Yeah. If somebody is telling you what your type is and you’re not, it’s not a journey of self-discovery for you. That is not ethical. Uh, only you get to decide that. And if someone is telling you what you can or cannot do because of your type, like be together with somebody else. Like where you said, like you said, like, oh, we shouldn’t, we shouldn’t fit, right?
[00:51:51] Elise: Yeah. then that it just, it’s not true. It’s all about awareness, self-regulation, self-management, and giving yourself what you need. Like, so if we go back to the first part of what we were talking about in terms of productivity and task lists and time and all that kind of stuff. One of the things that I ask people when they’re stuck, they have this thing that’s on their list forever and is just not making progress, and they really do wanna do it, and they’re just stuck.
[00:52:16] Elise: Right? We get to look at, okay, what do you need right now? What do you really need in order to get this done? And sometimes it can be the simplest, tiniest little thing that they hadn’t thought about. And other times it’s a mindset thing. But sometimes it’s just like, oh, well I just need to print it out and then review it.
[00:52:35] Elise: And it’s been sitting there for weeks undone because they thought, that’s not efficient, that’s not effective. I should be able to review this on my computer screen, right? I cannot tell you how many times I seriously have put in my task list, Elise, print out the damn thing or open the document and look at it, right?
[00:52:54] Elise: Because it’s just a matter of saying like, what do I really need? Other folks, it was seriously like, I need a second monitor. I’m like, go get a second monitor. Like I really don’t wanna spend more money in my business. Get on Facebook marketplace, look for a free monitor, and she posted to her community.
[00:53:08] Elise: Somebody had a free monitor, she picked it up the next day and she was good to go. Right? And so I know whether it’s personality type, whether it’s the time of day, you like to feel active, whether it’s needing two monitors, whether it’s needing a bigger desk or a bigger table to actually do your work.
[00:53:24] Elise: Whether it’s having storage bins for the different projects that you’re working on so that you can like keep some sanity, whatever you might need. Give yourself what you need. And so assessments can be a great starting point to help identify needs and, and keep bringing that back to yourself. So, so Myers Briggs, I highly recommend for being able to understand like how your, your energy gets used up and what you need.
[00:53:50] Elise: Yeah. And how you give your best to the world. And Engram, we can talk about that at another time. Engram is my favorite assessment and that is really all. What motivates your behavior, what it is that is under the hood that is operating without you being aware of it and bringing it to your awareness so you can know what is getting in your way and how to branch out in other directions to move things forward.
[00:54:14] Kam: Oh yeah. I definitely need to have you on again, we definitely need to discuss. That, but I do wanna link if you have a link for the Myers Briggs, I do wanna put that in the show notes. Yeah. So be sure that I get that and, and I will. But, um, before I let you go, because I’m gonna have to, um, please let everybody know where they can find you, whether they need a life coach, whether they need a community, whatever, uh, whatever you have.
[00:54:45] Elise: What, where can they find.
[00:54:48] Elise: The best place to find me and what I’m doing and what I’m up to is on Instagram and it’s productivity breakthrough is my handle at productivity breakthrough, and that’s where you’ll see my podcasts that go live. So I have the Productivity Breakthrough podcast and all that kind of stuff where I get to have awesome conversations with people.
[00:55:03] Elise: But I also spend episodes doing step by step explanation on how to do certain things. So there’s gonna be some fun stuff coming up there. We’ll have, um, word for the year, we’ll have the Burning Bull ritual. We’ll have all sorts of kind of closing out the year. Step by step things that are gonna be coming out on the podcast.
[00:55:19] Elise: So that would be really cool. Follow on Instagram, follow the podcast, and then if you’re wanting to run an experiment around managing your day and deciding what matters most each day, I have a dare to prioritize challenge that I’ll be doing in February. So if people wanna sign up to be a part of that live challenge, they can.
[00:55:38] Elise: And I’m actually gonna have a DIY version of it soon. So nice. You’ll find all of that though on my Instagram handle. Like I’ll have all of it there and I will
[00:55:45] Kam: be sure to link to it. So that would be awesome. Of course. Well, Elise, thank you so much again for coming on and oh my gosh, you have just some gold nuggets. I cannot wait to look through the notes and get everything transcribed, so, but I’d appreciate you cover on so much.
[00:56:06] Elise: Thank you. Thank you for creating the space for the creators. It’s important for all of us to be supported and to have you bringing experts to your audience is just so cool. Thank you for letting me be one of them.
[00:56:17] Elise: I appreciate it. You’re gonna make me cry. It’s important. It’s important, you know, we’re doing, we’re doing the stuff out here, lady. We’re doing
[00:56:24] Kam: it. I know, I know. I, I hope we can, I I wanna reach as many people as possible,
[00:56:30] Elise: so I hear you. Well, I’m, I’ll be very excited to share this with all my. Awesome.
[00:56:35] Kam: Well, we will talk soon, so
[00:56:38] Elise: Sounds good.
[00:56:38] Kam: All right. Bye Elise.